Tuesday, January 13, 2009

MOST OVERRATED EMCEE OF ALL TIME

Peace:

Let get it cracking. I know that many of us love to talk emcee’s. We love to dissect lyrics and content and their meaning. Some records just hit us at a point in our life when the message was coinciding with something we were feeling. When this happens we deicide that the artist or group that exposed your feelings has to be the greatest emcee ever. We hold that dude down no matter what, no matter what argument. Sometimes it takes that artist or group that one moment to connect with you, maybe gave you a pound at a show, or stopped to sign a shirt or a hat. You might have been luke warm on them but after that moment you just held them down like they were the greatest thing since the creation of hip hop. I feel that many emotions make up our favorites list. Hopefully it is about more than what I just talked about, cause lets face it, maybe less than 1% of you out there get to chop it up with an artists that has put out music you like. Many of us get caught up in the hype, drink the kool-aide, and buy the bridge, if you will. So many fans are just dick riders, lets keep it 100. You know what I am talking about. There are so few that can really talk lyrics and artists. Just cause you know that artists biggest single does not mean they should be G.O.A.T material and yet they are there. We scoff and laugh but these rappers have touched people and thus have gotten props where they might not have been deserved. This is not about dissing anyone who makes music and I want to make that clear. This blog is not about tearing someone down; I am not built like that. This blog is not to take away any ones shine or credibility, that is not my place. I am just simply saying that there are many rappers who I feel are over rated. This is my personal list. These are my personal feelings and I hope that this will start some real conversation and not just spewing hate, cause if that happens, I will just take this down. Hip Hop Critic is about those who love and know this music to have intellectual conversations about this culture and artists that we love. Here is my list:

1-Tupac: Many of you already got your gloves on and are ready to go at it, but at least let me explain. Tupac was able to convey great emotion through song. He was able to make great songs. Many of these songs are classics, “Brenda’s Got A Baby”, “ I Get Around”, “Hit’em Up”, “How Do You Want It”, “Wonder if Heaven’s got a Ghetto”. These are great songs, but to be a great emcee you have to be able to not only make a great song, but to be witty with the word play, and Pac was just real straight forward and did not really flip the language in a way that proved he was a word smith. He was a great rapper, a rapper who moved millions with his voice and emotion, but as an emcee he was not all of that, and certainly does not deserve to be mentioned in the top 5 of all time. He is not ever in my top ten, not even in my top 15, personally.

2-C.L. Smooth: How can so many people love this dude so much and he only really made one record in his whole life that was any good? If you really listen to those rhymes on T.R.O.Y they are all over the place and really hard to follow. The tracks were so bonkers that everyone fell in love with the song and eventually love C.L. Smooth. Show me one other example where he was witty with the rhymes other than the above song I mentioned and we can have a debate. Lets be clear, with Pete Rock, C.L. would have nothing to stand on

3-Kool Keith: No again don’t get me wrong, I love Ultra Magnetic and I use to hang with Keith in the Latin Quarter and have been to the crib. When he went left and started with the Black Elvis/Doctor Octogon records, the backpack community and the underground embraced him for his eclectic style and manner. This does not make him an emcee, it only makes him kinda bugged out and different. Nowhere does he ever convey a thought that makes true sense in the context of his records. He is a showman without question so the Em in the cee, gives him some love, but he is not an emcee you go around quoting and many people and caught in the hype

4-EPMD: Eric Sermon and Parrish Smith, know to the world as EPMD made some great records. It is easy to say that they made one of the best albums of all time, Strictly Business. They came out at a time when Rakim had come from Long Island and put a spotlight on those artist from out there. Eric and Parrish always sounded like a broke version of Rakim with Eric using Rakim’s flow and Parrish using Rakim’s hardness. Many people love EPMD and they should love them for their songs and not for their rhymes, which are hard to remember with out the music underneath them.

5-Young Jeezy: I hear so many people talk about Jeezy as this great emcee, especially young hustlers in the game, who relate to his success without him leaving the trap. Here is a secret for you that you might not know all you Jeezy fans. HE DOESN”T EVEN CONSIDER HIMSELF AND EMCEE AND HE DOESN’T CARE. Check the interview I did with him on our you tube channel www.youtube.com/serchlitemusic and see for yourself. How can someone be considered a great emcee when they themselves don’t care about being one.

6-Q-Tip: There are a lot of fans of ATCQ but we love the music they made and the songs they made. Q-Tip is a mad simple emcee, and his flow was always on point and his rhymes were always flwoing with the track, but you could never see TIP being this lyrical miracle that many put him up there to be. I love Tribe but I could not see any of TIP’S verses being said without you thinking about the track underneath them. A great emcee makes you forget the track and focus on his words and TIP ain’t the one.

7-RZA: Again I love the Wu, but RZA rhymes were always real bugged and unnecessary. He got some shine on the Gravediggaz album, but his Bobby Digital album was not a record you listened to because of his lyrical ability, but his production skills.

8-Guru-Gang Starr: I love this dude as a person as well, but without primo’s beats, he is just an ordinary rapper, not even an emcee, Primo made him an emcee

9-Supernatural: This is one of the greatest of-the-head- emcees there has ever been, but he cannot write. He get his props for his battle skills tho and I would not want to battle him, well…maybe?

10- Prime Minister Pete Nice-3rd Bass: LMAO!!! I am kidding, that is my dude for life and a hell of an emcee.

What’s your opinion, I’d like to know
Serch

23 comments:

  1. Wow! Not pullin the punches I see, fam.

    I understand what you're saying about 2pac. I'm not a huge fan but Me Against The World was definitely a solid album so I couldn't put him at number 1. For the same reasons, tho, I feel he's overrated.

    C.L.? What about Lots of Lovin or For Pete's Sake? I don't hear him mentioned in people's top lists too often so I can't say he's overrated. But not underrated either.

    Kool Keith gets too much props for being weird. He's dope but being strange doesn't qualify you as a lyrical wizard.

    EPMD - I gotta disagree on that one. Business As Usual is an amazing album. Parrish WAS definitely the more lyrical of the two but Erick had that crazy style. They had great chemistry live too, (before the home invasion crap).

    Young Jeezy - Agreed. I'm not feelin anything but dude's voice.

    Q-Tip - Disagreein again. "Back in the days when I was a teenager/ before I had status and before I had a pager/you could find the abstract listenin to Hip-Hop/My pops used to say it reminded him of bebop/I said "well daddy don't you know that things go in cycles/way that Bobby Brown is just ampin like Michael". Dude's style is so conversational it gets underrated, in my opinion. Also, dope live.

    RZA - Kinda on the fence on this one. I love it when he does those bugged out double-cadence flows like on Meth's Mr. Sandman. He does that speed up and slow down thing too. But the solo albums do kinda lack. He just doesn't seem to be able to carry an album by himself. "Oooh we love you Rakeem!"

    Guru - yeah, as much as I love him, he is kinda over rated. I think he's a lot better than ordinary but a lot of it is because of his ill voice. Again, dope live.

    Supernat - agreed. Dude can not make an album...

    I have two upsetting ones to add.

    1) Jadakiss - I don't get it. Someone is gonna have to sit me down and explain to me how he is dope. Everybody tells me it's his punchlines. What punchlines? Chino XL has punchlines. Jada has a certain swagger but not much more to me.

    2) Dare I say it? Biggie. I think Biggie is overrated. Don't get me wrong, he's dope! But, as an emcee, I don't think he deserves the hero worship he receives. I like most of Ready to Die. I don't like Life After Death. I have a personal attachment to the album and the man but I think that it's overrated. I only feel 3 songs on that album. His actual stage show was just okay to me, (yes, I DID see him live). His stage presence wasn't the best. But to say he's doper than Rakim, KRS, and a slew of others is just bull. KRS doesn't write his lyrics down either. Is that the criteria? Go ahead, scream on me.

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  2. I totally agree with all the emcees mentioned on this list...GURU and RZA could be debatable to some but not to me...Just a quick question: Why is it everytime I'm at a bar or a party I get grilled for saying Biggie is better than Tupac lyrically? Theres no question Tupac is a legend as a poet, writer, actor, etc...But how many times can you rhyme hennessey and enemies? LOL! He's still in my top ten emcees though.

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  3. I completely agree on Tupac. He was way too simplistic. I still believe if he looked like Craig Mack no one would give a damn about him.

    I can't believe Guru made this list. He's underrated in my opinion. The Moment Of Truth album solidified his greatness for me.

    As for C.L. Smooth, I don't hear tons of praise being heaped on him. I would consider him accurately rated. He was nice, but not special and I don't think most people think of him as anything more than that.

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  4. This post is unbalanced. If you list the Top 10 Overrated - then you need to list the Top 10 Emcee's who you think qualify as opposite and let's see who stands toe-to-toe. I already know Nas and KRS-1 make that other list hands down.

    Definately think your crazy for listing Guru, Q-Tip, and Tupac! The reason why I say that is because cats can still listen to their music TODAY and hear a bar or a verse that never made sense before at an earlier time and get something relevant out of it NOW...these great artists created PROGRESSIVE music that will never go out of style!!! The wordplay and scenarios were ill and trendsetting at the time, and if it wasn't so inspiring and influential to youth conciousness, than white boys wouldn't be studying rap lyrics at ivy-league schools as class requirements as we speak! In my opinion, you need to rethink those 3 bro...the others well yeah maybe.

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  5. i usually critique emcees on three criteria: voice, flow & content. guru's voice is just GOLDEN and his flow is pretty legit (even if it's just standard street). strongly disagree. point well taken on primo but i still bump the jazzmasters.

    kool keith almost made my UNDERRATED list. us backpackers (i guess i'm getting pigeonholed) embrace him not just because he's abstract as hell, but because he COOKS. and folks in my circle DO quote him, a lot.

    i agree 100% with pac - and with rza as an emcee, but he's much more than that of course.

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  6. LMAO at Pete Nice, way to him on blast Serch.
    Im gonna have to agree with you on this list except Q-tip. Ive always dug ATCQ and I like Tip's laid back flow.

    Personally, I think MF DOOM is mad overrated. He was decent back in the KMD days but now he sounds like a bad hybrid of Kool Keith and Ghostface..... I know some aren't gonna like hearin that one.......

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    1. DOOM just goes over your head. Look up "That's That" on rapgenius, and I think you'll take that one back haha.

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  7. Nice to see this topic has sparked a good debate !

    First up, props for putting tupac on your list Serch, yes he made some good tracks but he also made a lot of average stuff too. (I doubt he'd even make my top 50)

    Interesting that you picked Guru. I remember there was a review of a Gangstarr album where the reviewer gave a separate score to guru and primo as he felt guru's rhymes wheren't on point (not surprisingly guru didn't agree with that !)

    I think both CL Smooth and Guru "suffered" on one level from being attached to incredible producers.

    There was always a feeling of "what if they didn't have pete rock / premier doing their beats ?" which I think got to them so they went for self and didn't do as well.

    Supernatural is good live, he might be better off releasing soundboard recordings of shows ?

    I can't say I ever overrated RZA as I wasn't aware anybody actually rated him as a great Emcee in the first place ! (I think his style works fine as a verse on a Wu Tang record but I'm not interested in his solo career)

    Q-Tip is definitely one of the greatest BEHIND the boards (I think some people don't realise how good a producer he is) but I always checked more for Phife's verses on tribe records.

    I respect your viewpoint but I'm too big of an EPMD fan to agree with that choice.

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  8. fuck it, I'ma catch flack but I have to say Biggie was easily the most overrated dude to ever rap. He had some good verses, but he had some of the most wack ass punchlines ever. I mean he said "in the middle like Monie" like what 7 years after Monie Love had dropped off the face of the earth. Even Eric Sermon cringed at that line. It's just one example but he had a lot of questionable lines. I can hoenstly say I believe he shouldn't even be on a top 20 emcee list. RIP it's a shame he died, but that doesn't change the fact his rhymes were simple and some of his Punchlines made me want to stop listening to rap all together.

    Guru got over because of Primo's beats. Just To Get A Rep has pretty good lyrics. But Guru says shit like "Lemonade is a popular drink and it still is" I think both Biggie & Eric cringed at that line. Guru is horrible, there I said it...

    I agree on Q-Tip, but come on he rapped with Phife Dawg! Phife said 'I'll take off my shoe, and beat you with my shoe' Having Tip on this list, but no Phife is criminal. That line I quoted made EVERY emcee ever cringe, and I mean Master P "UUUUUUUGGGGH!" type cringe.

    Canibus needs to be on that list, he read some books and recites what he read. HIs beats are mostly very horrible, and his lyrics are forgettable. I laughed at him rapping about how the earth isn't mostly water and if you took all the creatures out of the sea the level would drop much lower. Dunno if he's really overrated because the only people who like him seem to be fools on the internet who believe the bigger the words an emcee uses the doper they are.

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    1. You can't just take half a line and use em against these emcees you named, anyone could come back with real dope lines said by both guru and phife. and that lemonade line isn't literal homie... straight over your head...

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  9. I don't disagree with the list except I don't agree with penalizing an MC that had superior production. We don't hold it against KRS or Rakim for having underwhelming production. I also believe some MC's dumb their music down so you have no choice but to listen to their lyrics (see Ras Kass). I hate saying being a Tribe fan makes me biased and it just might. But, when you think of flow, vocabulary and content, Tip did it all. I've never heard him mentioned in anyone's Top 10 MC list therefore I don't think hes overrated. Also, he was an MC that always had me hitting the dictionary long before Keith Murray. Now, it was said that you couldn't think of Q-Tip without thinking of the music he flowed on which is an added bonus because Tip produced every Tribe album. Those samples that he flipped that we all dig for came courtesy of his father's Jazz collection. Not only did he create signature soundscapes that we all remember in instrumental form, he married the track with his lyrical content and you really can't think of one without the other. Nope, Tip pulled double duty and if anything, he might be the most underrated producer of all time. Give him his props, take him off this list and replace him with Lil Wayne or Plies. BTW I totally agree with the Pac argument. I've been saying that for years and when a Pac fan challenges me on that viewpoint I simply ask them to recite their facvorite verse of his which they never can. I'm sorry, but my favorite MC's are always some I can spit a verse from at the drop of a hat. They're the reason I ever decided to write a rhyme.
    -DJ Sureal

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  10. To DJ Sureal, I'd agree that if there was an underrated producers list, Q-tip would be right up there. I just want to be clear, could you give a few examples of what you consider to be Krs-One and Rakim tracks that have "underwhelming production" BUT you still like overall and some where you do like the production (just trying to understand your point of view on production fully)

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  11. Serch,
    I got to tell u I’m an old jack fan and always thought U, Pete and Sam Sever led the way for serious white hip hop artists and I thank you for that. You have and still do inspire me to create. But I have to quote Tribe on this “Your Bugging Out” Your bugging real hard saying Tip, Guru and RZA are overrated MC’s. I kinda know CL he lived in my building in Now Rule for a min and I agree his rhymes was all over the place. I’m writing this at my job and I don’t have a chance to get real detailed as far as naming tracks that exemplify their mcing skills and I mos def know the difference from an MC/lyricist to a rapper. If need be I’ll take the extra time out of my life show case how nice the three above named ripped it up on wax. RZA on ghost face’s album and on Rae’s album “WHAT” his lyrics stop u dead in ur tracks. Yeah Bobby Digital is a little trippy but he’s experiment and growing. Guru on the track “the Planet” and Tonz of Gunz or Mass Appeal, he is kicking it about very relevant issues. Tip; every track he spits on in the Low End theory is a lesson of what was going on in life at that moment and also on Midnight Marauders. Tip has gone commercial and his style has changed but he is still in my opinion top 15 greatest. Serch man, RZA will bomb you with knowledge; the guy is so smart as a MC, producer and 5%.
    You have the right to your opinion but you get the serious Gas face!!!!!!!

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  12. ok,super interesting topic,and I can agree on most cases,being that even though I acknowledge pac as a charismatic rapper,I was never impressed,even if I evolved from listening to music with myears and brain,to feeling it in my soul,still,no effect.CL conveys an attitude and laidback charm,and I dug "I got a love"and "T.R.O,Y"as much as anyone,but I don;t think he's overrated,in fact,I had never ever seen anyone take him into consideration.If there exists an underrated MC,it has to be Chubb Rock,but,without straying from the subject,I was 14 when EPMD came out,and laughed at them the first time I heard it,as I was born and raised abroad,and was far from the hype,and quick to form my own opinion,as rap music was as foreign in my country back then as bachata music must be in India.RZA works well within the clan structure,but is a mess by himself,bobby digital was a big letdown for me.Guru is dope,for real,I quote him sometimes,q-tip as well,I think you should switch them with MF doom and quasimoto.Kool Keith was dope,after the four horsemen,can't quite say,I do love his voice,and poppa large is a dope track.pete nice was fresh,come on!lol.(what did he ever mean with a"ludicrous buddhist?"on "wordz of wizdom"?now that we're here?Ive been wanting to know that since 89,better late than never!
    to finish off,my ears haven't been blessed with the curse of hearing young jeezy,but if the old jeezy is any clue...another totally overrated rapper I agree with is jadakiss,and DMX,and Ice Cube,whose only anchor is his voice.Method Man,although dope,was overdimensionated in 94-95.

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  13. and yes,I agree with you about the importance of freestyle rhyming,100 percent.I did'nt consider myself an MC until I learned to freestyle at any time.AND,probably,my subconscious must have heard either you or KRS say that back when I was a teenager(see,quoting q-tip!lol!)thanks,serch!

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  14. I did forget to add EPMD grew on me afterwards,and I became an erick sermon -defsquad/hitsquad fan,felt I had to clear this up...

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  15. I agree with most of the list. Tupac for sure. I never really understood the attraction there. I think Tip was a momment in time. When tribe first hit...they where "it". But like all art forms, HipHop/MCing has moved forward. Comparing Tip to the a cat like say Black Thought or ELp is like comparing say...Dexter Gordon to John Coletrain...or Bix to Miles. Two different artists both from different times in the evolution of an artform. So Tip still gets my love.

    On the Kool Keith front. I think in his way he helped push the art form. In a way his bugged out shit was like...well to keep the theme going...sorta like a Ornett Coleman ro a Rashad Roland Kirk. Out there, but in a sense creating his own language. But again, this is all just my opinion.

    Peace,
    Joshua B.

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  16. WOW! EPMD? No damn way!!! IMO Strictly Business lyrically wasn't their best. Business As Usual, Unfinished Business and Business Never Personal are. Wow, I am still in shock! You know who I am really shocked not to see in your tyop 10? Lil Wayne. That dude is OVERRATED! Punchlines? LMAO!! He is good for hooks and thats about it. When he "rhymes" it's an embarassment to any cats from the 80's-mid 90's era of Hip Hop.
    I do agree with a few of yours Serch. I remember the song and the interview Guru did a while back where he said he is top 10 greatest emcee of all times! LMAO, again. No way. Your right, Preemo did make him an emcee and if he didn't have Preemo, it would be just another cat rhymin'. The proof to those in disagreement, just listen to his solo album Version 7.0
    I agree with 2Pac as well. I laugh when cats say 2Pac is better than KRS, Kane, Rakim, Kool G Rap, etc. Had Pac been put on a stage to face any of them (and you can add B-Real, Serch, Pete Nice, Big Pun, Ice Cube, Redman, Meth, GZA, Eminem, Biggie and Busta Rhymes), gave him a mic and said to freestyle battle, Pac woulda shit his pants! Thats real!
    I agree also on Young Cheesy, er, I mean Jeezy, Kool Keith, CL and RZA.
    I disagree with Q-Tip. Phife is better than Tip but Tip is really a really dope emcee to me.
    Yo Mike J- I agree with you on Jadakiss. H eis crazy OVERRATED. Styles P would run circles around him!

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  17. I totally agree with TUPAC. I have always thought he was completely overrated. An actor yes, emcee...no! I'm not really into emcees who turn thug after they get famous. That's some acting shit right there.
    I got one for ya serch.... BIGGIE..yup thats right. He had one dope album and one pop rap album that was puffy'd to death. One dope album does not qualify one as the greatest emcee ever. I call that marketing on puffy's part.
    Another one...JAY Z. He is not the greatest. You know it and so does everyone else who knows the deal. It's all marketing . Simple minded people buy that shit and eat it up and start arguments on forums and generate publicity. That's all it is.

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  18. Wassup Serch

    In my opinion I would say hands down without a shadow of a doubt the most overrated MC of All time is Biggie.
    I disagree with EpMd being overrated I don't think people ever thought of them as Great MCs in the same breath as Kane, KRS, Rakim or Nas. Same could be said of Q Tip, people liked his voice, but even in Tribes Hay Day I think they got their proper respect no more and no less, so again Tip wasn't over rated they did what was expected of them.
    I also think you were too hard on Guru,maybe his stuff with Solar isn't as good as the stuff he did with Premier but he held it down on numerous Jazzamatazz albums.
    I'm not sure if CL is Overated or just has a higher opinion of lyrical skillsthan his actual skills.
    Lastly Tupac I personally was never a massive fan of his music, but say the affect he had on my friends, and although it he didn't appeal to me, I respect the impact he had on so many people, I always felt that Pac was a passionate and always said what he felt needed to be said even if he was wrong, his conviction in my opinion is only matched by KRS ONe and Chuck D.

    Let me know your thoughts Peace Raze

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  20. Eminem? Well, as far as overrated goes... The level of acclaim he achieved was completely uncalled-for. I believe this was in part do his his extreme marketability and his value as a redeemer of the failures of his white predecessors. He has won Grammy's, an Academy award, and he is no. 82 in Rolling Stone magazine's 100 Greatest Artists of All Time list, ahead of music legends such as Miles Davis, Diana Ross, and the aformentioned Tupac Shakur. Not only do I believe he is undeserving of such praise I attribute his success entirely to the parody in the American recording industry. My personal contention is that he was simply in the right place at the right time, so to speak, and therefore was the arbitrary target of a bigoted industry impatient to hurl its trophies upon. It could have been anyone, he is absolutely replaceable.

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  21. It's always weird to me when people think pac is overrated. I just attribute it to them wanting punchlines. Which are cool, but not completely necessary. Pac had that presence on songs that is just so rare. And you think about all he had done by age 26. Other MCs get so much longer. He damn sure made way more impactful music than 3rd Bass. I don't really agree with Q Tip being on there either.

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